Kaftan

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Kaftan

Philipppp 15 Nov 2007 20:37

It's once more me bothering everyone with all the kit I want to make despite having no time at all. Anyway, at TORM I acquired some beautiful wool with a good weave (couldn't resist it, sorry Veronica), which I shall, with some luck and given the Christmas vacation, turn into a lined kaftan of the longer kind (i.e. not one of those described as "wrap-around jacket" in the relevant kit section on the Wiki, but more along the riding coat lines). Now I looked at some of the pattern found in the different links and while some of them don't seem to make any sense at all, others seem managable.
I am obviously aware that not many will have had experience with making kaftans, but I thought I'd nevertheless ask if anyone has any advice/hints/things to watch out for/explanations for patterns/tips/cookies/general comments on making it, authenticity, how to best do the lining or whatever else you can think of. Or if you happen to come across any more good web pages or have any book recommendations on kaftan matters, please let me know!!

I'll be using wool and also wool to line it (two different shades of green), but the material is quite thin, so it should nevertheless be comparatively light weight. I haven't started worrying about silk cuffs or fur around the edges yet. … Yet.

Re: Kaftan

bunni 15 Nov 2007 23:32

The two options are the Germanic or the Nomadic. The Germanic should be wrap around but shouldn't be longer than knee-high. The Nomadic should be buttonned or toggled or frogged, definitely not just wrap-around, and can be as long as you like, but should be capable of riding a horse in…

The good link is http://www.miklagard.nvg.org.au/costume/rus/trader/rus_description.htm
Steer clear of making a hidiously hugely gussetted one like the ShadowDragon. You *can* make a non-rear-split riding coat, and it should be quite gussetted, but not that much. That's much too much.

Last edited on 24 Mar 2010 13:54 by bunni Show more

Help with shoes

otherem 26 Nov 2007 18:48

Greetings Wychwooders! I was hoping I might be able to partake of your superior knowledge and advice.
I recently bought some very swanky authenti-shoes, only to find that they are exceedingly slippery to wear and I spent the whole time anxiously creeping around awaiting impending ankle breakage at any moment. Bjorn tells me this problem is common. What have people done to give their shoes some grip? Suggestions?
Thanks :)
The other Emily

Re: Kaftan

Dominic 27 Nov 2007 04:12

that's beornwulf thankyouverymuch…

Re: Kaftan

otherem 28 Nov 2007 03:41

Sorry milord…

Re: Kaftan

Philipppp 03 Dec 2007 09:57

To return to the original topic, I'm still not sure whether to go for the Germanic or Nomadic style. I guess Nomadic would be a bit more appropriate for my Rus Viking, but Germanic wouldn't be wrong either and according to one of the Kaftan websites they found a buttonless kaftan at Birka (but they also found several buttoned ones, according to Ewing, so I'll probably get buttons), which would be quite suitable since I'm also going for the Birka-style hat, so I shall pursue this further.
If anyone has any more advice/links/knowledge, please share it!

Re: Kaftan

bunni 03 Dec 2007 14:15

Yeah, apparently Hagg suggested there were some buttonless kaftans at Birka. Haven't read the article myself because it's foreign, but it's:
Hägg, I. (1986) 'Die Tracht'. In: G. Arwidsson (ed.) Birka II:2. Systematischen Analysen der Gräberfunde, pp.51-72. KVHAA: Stockholm.

I'd want to read it to find out if they mean kaftans made without buttons, or kaftans without surviving buttons. Are they just cloth or wooden buttons that haven't survived the centuries?

Re: Kaftan

Philipppp 03 Dec 2007 15:05

I think I'm becoming more fond of the idea of the buttoned coat, even though that means that I need to get nice buttons some time (I may use cheap wooden ones for the time being though).
Another nice picture, though only very brief description, can be found here:
http://www.gelfling.dds.nl/viking%20kaftanm.html
I do like that style, although I'll probably make mine slightly longer, also keeping in mind that the person in the picture claims to have made it by converting a tunic, hence it has tunic length, and actually looks more like a glorified tunic than a completely different type of garment. The pattern is therefore very simple though, compared to some of the other kaftan patterns, particularly those with the multiple gigantic gussets.
I must also say that the buttons look rather nice, though I'm not quite clear how they work, i.e. why there are these red band on both sides. Is it that the button is attached on the one side, there is a red loop on the other, while the one on the button side is just decoration?

Now as I might have mentioned, I'm planning to line it with another layer of wool (I have two rather nice pieces of really quite thin wool, so it wouldn't be too thick in the end). I'm not quite sure about the authenticity however. I haven't come across any mention of thin wool lining, although in general lining seems to have not been unusual. It wouldn't exactly seem irrational to have two layers of wool given the climate in some of the Viking/Rus areas. But if anyone has relatively conclusive evidence (as far as that's possible) that that's definately something that didn't happen, then let me know before it's too late!

Re: Kaftan

bunni 03 Dec 2007 18:11

Good link! Nice page. Same pattern as New Varangian Guard, as well. Which is cool, and is an easy pattern (being basically just a lengthened tunic with added slits).
I think the button has been attached to red thread, then the red thread sewn onto the kaftan. With a loop of red thread used on the other side as the button hole. Looks pretty! And easier than doing buttonholes, which are a bit of a bitch (and I don't think provenanced for our period?).

I've been looking through my new nomadic book, and they do feature a couple of long buttonless coats, held together by wide cloth belts. These are on the more central asian nomads tho (rather than the western nomads we want), so less applicable for our kit. Still, thought I'd mention it.

For my kaftans, I'm still undecided between using wooden toggles or thread frogs. I've found some nice frogs, and they will look more fancy…
Think I'm going to go for the off-centre look tho.

Re: Kaftan

bunni 04 Dec 2007 13:14

Oh, been searching pretty nomadic asymetical caftans. And will definitely be making one, held together by frogs. Check out the new links i've added on the coats page. Mmm…

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